Detritus

[matt_b]

Detritus

After many searches i'm still confused about detritus, what is it? why when i'm watching my tank i suddenly see this brown stuff
being dumped out of the rock onto my rock base?

I've read mixed views that if it's out of sight its not a problem, i've made a few modifications to my tank where i've succesfully
ridded the detritus from the base of my rock by at least 90% and also have a sand bed but am now wondering if detritus has any benifits in a reef? theres a few
pictures i've seen where critters seem to flourish in detritus conditions, will my tank lose out as any detritus that lays on the bottom of
my tank gets blown out from the bottom of the rock then filtered out of my tank

would love to hear what you guys think

Thankyou

Matt

[tuan]

Detritus - in my view, simply put, is solid waste product that doesn't get broken down/eaten or used up in anyway within the short life span of our reef tanks. So after 'food' has been through the food chain, been consumed by one thing or another, finally being pretty much innert.

There are mixed views on whether it's bad or good as you've found out. My own considerations :-

+ detritus particles has a huge total surface area which is coated in micro algae/bacteria colonies. This is an important source of food for inverts that captures or filter the water columns, e.g. coral polyps.

+ where I leave detritus to settle and pile up in the system (e.g. in the overflow box), a microcosm of environment exists with the fine substrate layer allowing all sorts of worms/pods to grow.

+ this area of detritus isn't covered in algae, even though it is exposed to light, which leads me to discount the scare stories that detritus is laden with phosphate and nutrients.

+ my sand bed "diversity" seems to have been enriched by the extra fine particles rather than being clogged up.

Having said that, a considerable amount is removed from my system via the sumps as a settling tank, as well as the skimmers. With hindsight I would have built in a more active mechanism to remove 'some' out of the water column as with strong turbulent flow the water isn't all that clear. Floating particles is good for the coral polyps and filter feeders, but does prevent some light penetration some what.

[matt_b]

Tuan,

i appreciate your answer and going by your tank you obviously know how to run it succesfully!

I feel really bad questioning you as i basically know nothing yet but from the knowledge i've gathered from various places detritus seemed like something to try your hardest to keep to a minimum

Please put me in my place as i really wanna learn about marine life but if food is added to a tank, fish food, will that not give filter feeders food without them relying on detritus to feed on? if theres no detritus won't they use unused food instead??

Since i made the modification to my base i have never had to clean any algae off my glass and my sand is pure white, unlike before when i had to scrape every day, now maybe thats part of life with a 3 month tank?? theres only one spot in my tank where theres detritus and after researching these long hair like tenticles are from a spagehetti worm thats collecting it under its hole

I must admit since the changes theres a lot of particles blowing about my tank but from what i've heard this will pay dividends with any coral i add!

Matt

[tuan]

Matt
I feel really bad questioning you as i basically know nothing yet but from the knowledge i've gathered from various places detritus seemed like something to try your hardest to keep to a minimum

No need to feel bad. I always question everybody as no one is completely right all the time about reef keeping. I agree that everywhere you read detritus is so nasty and people filter out like it's the plague.

if theres no detritus won't they use unused food instead?? well yes, if you know the exact food to feed to all the animals, and how much food, and have the 'right' food and you feed at exactly the right time when the animals are hungry. I'm just pointing out that the bacterial/micro algae coating on detritus particle is also a significant food source, and if the filter feeders like fan worms have already evolved to make use of it, then why not just let them?

Since i made the modification to my base i have never had to clean any algae off my glass and my sand is pure white, unlike before when i had to scrape every day, now maybe thats part of life with a 3 month tank?? theres only one spot in my tank where theres detritus and after researching these long hair like tenticles are from a spagehetti worm thats collecting it under its hole
I guess it depends on whether you run the tank like a lab experiment or try to allow it to be as natural as possible. Sand in the sea bed isn't pure white, and without any detritus would the all the worms survive & thrive, and if not then we're losing out on the diversity front.

theres a lot of particles blowing about my tank but from what i've heard this will pay dividends with any coral i add! - the particles are detritus ;)

[matt_b]

Thanks Tuan i really appreciate your answers

I never realised dirt was a major factor in a tank and have tried my hardest to remove it, must admit that i was told to supplement food while i wait to stock with Kent Micro-Vert 2 -3 times a week

:) Maybe it does sound like i'm a lab technician but i just wanted to try and get it right the first time :wacko:

Yep your right thats detritus blowing about in my tank as i never had that problem before, the water is never clear but apparantly this will only help when i start stocking, not a problem

Once againg thankyou for replying

MAtt

[matt_b]

Just to add to my last post i'm starting to think that all the advice people give about waiting and researching about marine is wrong, there are so many different opinions that it get confusing :wacko:

I am honestly starting to think that the best way is not to research and just go for it!!

Matt

[simon garratt]

Hi Matt.

don't be disheartened. If you only take in a fraction of what you read, it all builds up in the end to a degree that untruths and illogicalities scream out at you when reading.

Keep it up. its a fascinating subject and hobby. You don't need to learn everything all in one go.....bite sized chunks in each area are a good way to go.


regards


Si. :)

[matt_b]

Thanks Si

Maybe my problem is that i take to heart what i read tooo much, good or bad!!, i've a lot to learn which maybe another reason why my first marine tank has been a great hobby even without fish or corals! I love my LR :lol:

Thankyou once again for steering me in the right direction

Matt

[Mike4271]

Originally posted by matt_b@Dec 13 2005, 13:40


:) Maybe it does sound like i'm a lab technician but i just wanted to try and get it right the first time :wacko:




Actually Matt, you have a point there, I think that we all have a little of the Lab Tech in us, just try and picture it as the people who help us on this forum are the guys in the white coats, and we are the guys standing behind them trying to take everything in, in the hope of one day getting that white coat ;)

[L200]

So should detritus stay or go then??

[simon garratt]

So should detritus stay or go then??

That all depends on wether your system has been desghned to handle it, and what type of detritus you are encountering. Inert detrital sediment consisting of cast amphipod shells etc (mainly Chitin) dont reprisent a problem at all and can actually add to the structure of substrates etc (big debate in sand beds ;) ) imo giving a very mud like texture which is easy for tunneling critters to move through. Non inert ditritus (uneaten food / feaces) is a different matter if your system hasnt got the diversity above bacterial to break it down. Some systems can suffer from this if they are heavily stocked with preditory small fish (dottybacks, manderins, sand sifters, long nosed butterfly's etc, etc as they heavily impact on the critter population that consumes and assimilates a large quantity of this organic matter. Like wise fitting micron filter socks to overflows can also limit the density of critters as they and there larvae are filterd from the system along with water bourn waste particles leaving un filterd waste to rot bacterially adding to the nitrogen cycle in full rather than via assimilation and progressive breakdown..

so ultimately its a case of deciding what your own cicumstances dictate and how you feel about it as a subject for concern or benefit.

Nature doesnt worry about detritus, it adds to the diversity of micro-environments., and as we get closer to what could be considerd more natural systems, then its fairly logical thinking IMo place such a natural byproduct under the same banner as any other form of natural waste in a system. it can either break it down till its no longer harmfull, or it cant, in which case you have to step in and take action.


Regards

Si.

[Acropora]

Hi all

Detritus

Some (not many) systems really looking stinning as demonstrated through excellent coral growth and polyp extension. It it would seem that one of the common denominators is having a 'livestock balance' including not being overstocked with fish to 'over harvest the critters'.

While some would consider my tank sucessful, its not in balance, and I've noticed that after 2 or 3 years, the tanks needs a significant maintenance, which pivots around, a bloody good clean out. OK I know this can throw a reasonably well balanced tank into chaos, I remove the majority of the sand (sugar sand about 1" on average deep), and replace. I did this just over two years and after I saw a remarkable improvement in the coral growth.

It could be argued that this was a result of changing 50% of the water (used to siphone out the sand), but I've since done other big water changes and not seen the same improvement as changing the sand).

I've just repeated the exercise (started last week and removing the sand in batches based upon 70 gallon batches of fresh salt water). The sand bed may or may not have bacteria, I don't know, but there isn't a huge number of worms which i've seen in 'good' sand beds.


Fortunatly the sand was designed to give me access to the sand, the rocks are supported on glass shelves, and the rockwork is sits on the glass rather than on the sand.

Time will tell, whether this latest exercise will yield the results I would like, but from what I've seen from the past, its better to get the detritus out of the system.

Regards

Martin Lakin