View Full Version : cleaner shrimp fry
after a few attempts and a bit of reading ive decided to have a go at raising some of the above thought i would post on here what happens just in case anybodys interested.
the fry where released last night at about 11pm so i scooped out about 30ish and they are currently living in a 12x8x8 tank thats on top of my main tank.
the tank is just over half full and has brown paper on three sides to diffuse light.
they seem to be feeding on newly hatched brine shrimp (i can see what looks like a full stomach) and im going to change about half of the water with water from my main tank tomorrow.
ive already had two deaths and apparently they take about 120ish days to change from larvael to juvenile shrimps so this might be a very long post or a very short post depending on how i do but hopefully ether way it should be a bit of interest to sombody.
i will try to keep this updated with anything that happens good or bad
jamie
If you check out TMC web site it tells you all about raising them
Thanks for taking the time to share your experiences with your new project. I for one am certainly very interested to hear how it goes.:cool:
Very best of luck
Cheers
Chris :)
thanks for the interest everyone glad to know somebodys reading this :)
bit of an update for today, did a water change with the water from my main tank and everything seems fine, had a few more deaths so the numbers are going down a bit but hopefully some will survive for a while at least.
i've decided that i need to add an airstone for a bit of water movment so im off to buy a pump and stone tomorrow.
the fry still seem to have full stomachs so i will leave them with the brine shrimp at the moment but im going to look into enriching them somehow any ideas welcome
johnfish i had a look at the tmc website but all i could find was articles about them having them, not much about how they raised them, am i looking in the wrong place?
Jamieb,
good luck with this. Please keep us posted on how this goes.
I have so far managed to raise Bangai Cardinal and will soon be branching out.
Any chance of some pics?
Steve
BOXING SHRIMP
26-02-06, 21:06
our cleaner shrimps regulary release eggs into the tank but never really knew how to raise the fry so will watch with interest p.s. good luck rich....
thanks for the replys
spk,
good luck with the branching out, if your interested in more or the cardinals theres a guy on reef central that has bred a few different types if you look in the breeding forum it was near the top yesterday, seemed like he had quite good results.
boxing shrimp,
you should give it a try its very interesting to watch them and im sure ive seen them hunting the BBS
managed to get an air pump and stones today unfortunatly the shop dident have wooden ones just the normal but they seem to be ok now ive restricted to flow a lot.
ive also blacked off the tank a bit better because the fry seemed to stay in the corner where there was some light coming through, doing this seems to have brought them in to the water column more and should hopefully stop them from bumping into the sides so much (this seems to be a problem with them) i should add that i have left one side clear so that i can see them so this does let in some light.
they are still feeding well and i can now see tiny black eyes on them so i think they're growing.
thanks
jamie
marinebeginner
27-02-06, 21:32
i am having problems with my two cleaner shrimps, they seem to have eaten 1 x sandsifter starfish, 1 X Carpenteri wrasse, 1 x peppremint shrimp - that i know of.
Now i am not sure if they have eaten them once they are ill (killing them) or just cannibals!!!
Is this normal/possible?
How can i stop it?
i've never had a cleaner shrimp do this and ive got them with starfish, sexy shrimp and even neon gobies and they're fine. it seems very unlikely to me and i would think its more likely they are eating them after they have died, i would make very sure that nothing else could be responsible for the deaths
hope this helps
jamie
SUCCESS!!!! :D :D well not really but its pretty good and im pleased.
some of the shrimp fry have completed their first molt so the BBS must be working, by the way ive started to enrich with "bioplankton" and im using shell-less brine shrimp eggs which is saving me a lot of hassle as the cysts dont seem to bother the fry at all.
the airstone is making a huge difference aswell and next time i will definately have one one from the start.
now that they have passed the first hurdle they seem to be swimming a lot stronger and i can see a tinge of red on their tails, their eyes have become more pronounced on stalks now aswell.
hopefully by tomorrow they will all have compleated their first molt so i will keep you posted.
oh and sorry theres no photos but i dont have a camera good enough to see the fry, i could take some of the set-up and if someone who can upload pics (i cant) sends me an e-mail i will send them the pics to put on.
thanks
jamie
jamie,
are you keeping good notes on everything, because i believe this experience would make an excellent article, good luck on raising them.
oh , and you still need to use an external host , like photobucket or something and then put the link in your post
Cheers
John
look forward to seeing your setup as my cleaner shrimp are always have green egg sacks
not sure if this will work but i'll give it a try
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f387/quaysideaquatics/corals003.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f387/quaysideaquatics/corals002.jpg
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f387/quaysideaquatics/corals001.jpg
dont know why they ended up like that, damn computers.
anyway not good photos but you can see the smaller tank that the fry are in and the two containers with the BBS also the air pump etc.
when i get a chance im going to drill the fry tank and so that i can have water continuosly pumped from the main tank into the fry tank, im thinking of using a brine shrimp strainer as a filter for the overflow but ive not really decided on the final design yet
thanks for all the replys and if you have any ideas or input its all appreciated
jamie
MaidstoneMarine
01-03-06, 23:32
I've got four cleaners in my tank and this is something that I'd like to attempt one day in the future. Keep up the posts and the pictures!
Cheers
Chris
Sounds as if everythings going very well:D
Best wishes
Chris
hi people, shrimps are all still alive and kicking and seem to be doing fine, they've all got through the molt successfully and are hunting BBS as i type this.
on the equipment side i felt the water temp was'nt to stable so i've added a heater and thats sorted it out.
i did a quick "head" count when i did the water change today and theres still 20 left so its all good.
thanks for all the replys and the interest hope some of you are going to give this a try yourself as it really is amazing
jamie
way to go , mate
keep it up
John
Updates? :cool: Any more news, wer're getting concerned :eek:
It's just as much of a full time job feeding the reefers as the baby shrimp themselves you know :p
Cheers
Best wishes
Chris:D
sorry mate :)
everything is going well.
all the shrimps are still feeding well and seem to be growing.
im going to do a bit of reading and see what should be happing with the next molt, like when its supposed to be and whats supposed to happen
will let you all know what i find
cheers
jamie
Jamie - this is great stuff!!
Please keep us posted!!
Thanks for the update mate :)
Best of luck
Chris
ok i've had a dig about on the internet and the next stage im looking for is about the 11 day mark and i should be able to see claws starting to form:cool:. for those of you following this you'll know that this should be happening within the next couple of days so i'll keep you updated on this next molt and with a bit of luck it should go ok.
thanks for all the interest in this thread nice to know people are interested :D
jamie
I might have missed this, but did you start by feeding them on BBS? I have never got my baby Cleaner Shrimp past 1cm - no idea why. I found mine went mental for a certain frozen food (PM me for name), but maybe it lacked something which is why they never survived past 1cm, or they may just have been eaten - no room for spare breeding tanks so they took their chance in the main tank.
Unfortunatly one of the parents died during a moult so no babies for me until I have moved house and replaced it.
yes, they've been feeding on BBS since day one, it took me a few days to sort out enriching the BBS but now its sorted they seem to be doing well.
i would be interested to know the frozen food they fed on to give it a try as im trying to get them off the live food ASAP, also how long did they last in the tank as getting them to 1cm in a main tank with predators is pretty impressive
jamie
There are always hundreds of fry in the tank, of various sizes between 1cm and microscopic so I can't tell you how long it takes to reach that size. The only thing that seems to eat them is my mandarin. As for other fish, I only have a young pair of clowns and a dwarf angel who avoid all live food - they even seem to be wary of BBS!!
I'll PM you with the food name.
You are doing an excellent work.
I'm very interested in your breeding experience.
Please keep it updated.
For some information about breeding cleaner shrimps,
you can have a read this
http://www.reefsuk.org/articles/captivebreeding/breedcleanershrimp.php
I really hope you make a success.
Cheers,
Min
thanks for all the replys everyone :)
tombsc thanks for the pm, ill give it a try.
bangormin thanks for the article ive read that before, he seems to have had quite a bit of success keeping them.
i think all the fry have molted again as they seem to have claws now as described in my last post.
there seems to be only about 8-9 left so i think its unlikely that they'll get near 120 days let alone settle, im still postitive though as i have some ideas for the tank when its empty which will hopefully give some more flow in the tank as it appears the fry like a lot of flow.
anyway there are still a few left and their still feeding so i will keep them going for as long as possible and see how they do.
cheers
jamie
bit of an update today, only got 5 shrimp left now, im starting to wonder if the airstone is causing the water to evaporate so much that when i do a water change the difference in salinity is killing them off? the water looks like its at the wrong salinity when it goes in so i think this might be it, unfortunately the airstone is the only way i have of giving the water some movement so it needs to stay in there.
next time im definatly going to drill the tank and have the movement created by the flow in and out of the tank hopefully this will eliminate the salinity problems.
on that note though the 5 that are left seem to be doing great, they have a lot more colour and are still feeding well although i'm going to try and get them on to flake food this week so we'll see how that goes.
anyway comments and suggestions are always welcomed
thanks
jamie
Thanks for the update, sorry to hear of the losses though. I think that's always the problem with trying to raise the fry of any marine species, trying to agitate and filtrate the water without "throwing the baby out with the bathwater".
I think you could be right about the osmotic shock when changing the water, shrimps are supposed to be very sensetive to rapid environmental change.
Still it's all good experience though, best of luck with the "weaning" onto flake food :)
Cheers
Chris
thanks mate i'll keep you updated
jamie
well thats the last of them dead, bit of a shame but it does give me a chance to sort out the tank for the next lot.
the reason i lost them was due to me moving them into a small tub in order to try and sort out the salinitly problems, ironically they did'nt die from the move but because the holes in the tub were to big and the simply fell through into the main tank, bit disappointing as it took me ages to make the holes. never mind hopefully it will be more succesfull next time.
thanks to everyone who replyed to the post and ill post the breeding tank later if it works out.
jamie
sorry to hear that :( but congratulations on making it so far. I'm sure you'll crack it on the next go :)
Thanks for the posts so far as well, IMO aquaculture is the only real future for this hobby and it's great to hear about peoples experiences, it's the only way we're all going to learn about the challenges of breeding marine creatures which I don't believe will ever be straightforward.
Best of luck with the future programme!
All the best
Chris
Hi Jamie,
I'd like to echo Chris's message above, look forward to your next go
John
ditto
will you add the next episode here or should we watch for a new thread
blodger
thanks for all the replys.
blodger it depends if i find another cleaner shrimp, i unfortunatly lost my other one during my disasterous move a couple of weeks ago, i have a couple of sexy shrimp that look like there thinking about it but i would like to try some peppermint shrimp as they are apparently a great starting point, unfortunately im skint so unless anybody wants to swap some shrimp for some frags then im going to have to wait a while.
jamie
If you want any pics hosting then PM me and i`ll put up my email address for you to send the full size pics over to. I too am interested in your project :)
Richard D thanks for the offer but i've managed to sort out a photobucket account and the shrimp have all died hopefully ill have some more soon but we'll have to see
cheers
jamie
sorry to hear about your loss and hope you try again soon
Found Nemo, what now?
15-03-06, 09:05
good luck finding another cleaner!
Our peppermints spawned after 2 months of going in, wondered what the hell was going on! They seemed to last longer than our Cleaner fry do these days. You never know, you might find some have made it to safety under a rock?
thanks mate, im going to try peppermints next but i think i will keep trying with the cleaners and see what happens.
have you tried with your peppers yet?
jamie
Found Nemo, what now?
15-03-06, 22:41
We tried the first couple of times they spawned, no success though, we were using an in-tank net breeder, not enough flow IMO, net too fine to let enough water/microplankton through.
ive just got the book 'how to raise and train your peppermintshrimp' by April Kirkendoll ive not had a chance to read through all of it yet but what i have read its very good full of information and really easy to understand
if your thinking about doing it again then you should look into this book mine cost about £10 from amazon USA
I've got that book too. Alot of good info, has a bit on cleaner shrimps too.
Found Nemo, what now?
15-03-06, 23:26
thanks for the tip, another book on the wishlist! lol
Jamie, Good luck with this but I believe no one has ever successfully raised cleaners in captivity out side pro lab setups like TMC.
Fun trying though, and hopefully you will find a technique others havn't :)
Mr fish, a few people on reefcentral seem to have raised them through to settling and there is an article on reefsuk from someone saying they managed it, i dont know the truth behind these claims but i've no reason to doubt them.
it seems that raising them to 100-120 days is'nt the problem, getting them past there final molt is, there is apparently some chemical stimulous that they need to molt from larvae to shrimp, unfortunatly nobody can aggree on what it is, a common idea is that is something in corraline algae but a rock of this in the tank with the fry does'nt do anything so im not sure.
i know that hawaii had a lot of success but they were using NSW pumped straight through the systems, not something i can emulate but if anyone wants to pay for me to live in hawaii and try it i will grudgingly accept:D
jamie
possibly having the fry in a fuge setup woudl help?
I've actually come up with a good idea for once! ok your tank that they were in, give it a sand bed about 4-6 inches deep, sugar sand would be best. Then get some like rock and loads of calupra algae, make it into a fuge. Next get a small lamp over the tank not too bright.
Next get an airline and clamp from the main tank syphone water from the main system too the fuge. when full turn the clamp on so its only dripping into the fuge. Next get another piece of airline. Do the same but dripping out of the fuge and back into the main system. This way the fuge is constantly being cycle giving the shrimp fresh water. You can add a small airstone for slight flow if you require, and at the same time your adding a fuge to your main system. Thinking back at work i remember seeing baby shrimp about 1 cm long in our fuge which was like ths method. They grew in thier themselfs with no outside feeding so thier must of been natural food in the fuge. Obviously it will take a few weeks for the fuge to become mature. Not too sure if these shrimps where river shrimp or cleaners but they grew and lived thier! so i'd try that, i don't actually think you can fail!
good luck very interesting!
Tom
been thinking along the same lines myself tom, my idea was to use a brine shrimp strainer over a hole drilled in the tank, like the idea of making it a fudge though never thought of putting sand etc in to give them a natural food source.
thanks for that idea, watch this space!!!
jamie
ok cool! it'd be good if this pulls off (copywriting that idea) lol that means i now get soem babies wahoo!
Hope it works mate
Tom
possibly having the fry in a fuge setup woudl help?
I've actually come up with a good idea for once! ok your tank that they were in, give it a sand bed about 4-6 inches deep, sugar sand would be best. Then get some like rock and loads of calupra algae, make it into a fuge. Next get a small lamp over the tank not too bright.
Next get an airline and clamp from the main tank syphone water from the main system too the fuge. when full turn the clamp on so its only dripping into the fuge. Next get another piece of airline. Do the same but dripping out of the fuge and back into the main system. This way the fuge is constantly being cycle giving the shrimp fresh water. You can add a small airstone for slight flow if you require, and at the same time your adding a fuge to your main system. Thinking back at work i remember seeing baby shrimp about 1 cm long in our fuge which was like ths method. They grew in thier themselfs with no outside feeding so thier must of been natural food in the fuge. Obviously it will take a few weeks for the fuge to become mature. Not too sure if these shrimps where river shrimp or cleaners but they grew and lived thier! so i'd try that, i don't actually think you can fail!
good luck very interesting!
Tom
How do you get the syphon going both ways? Water can only be syphoned from the highest tank into a lower one can't it or have I read that wrong?
i think tom ment to pump the water in and when it fills up enough syphon it out, thats the only thing i wouldnt be sure about leaving overnight etc but as in my post im just going to drill it as its easier.
Tom, if i ever get any to settle then your first in line for some freebies
jamie
nope sorry i've said it wrong, what i mean is have your tank then fuge at mid level then sump under neith, so u syphon from the fuge to the sump but its stil all the same system
thanks for the freebires mate i'll hold u 2 that :D
no problem mate, although i would'nt hold my breath if i were you
jamie
thought i would post a quick update on this, i have set up a small refugium pretty much the same way tom (red) said but i drilled it as i had a good spot for it and it was easier.
i did have a brine shrimp filter on the outlet but it was a nightmare trying to keep the water flow constant so i have removed that and just have the hole open, if i do get some more baby shrimp i will have to find something to put over it but im not sure what yet so any ideas are welcomed.
anyway at the moment i have two peppermint shrimp and two sexy shrimp along with one of my original cleaners so hopfully i might get lucky soon
cheers
jamie
http://i51.photobucket.com/albums/f387/quaysideaquatics/refugium.jpg
If you weren't so far away, I'd donate my two cleaners to the cause :(
Best of luck
Cheers
Chris :)
thanks for the offer mate, im sure ill get some soon, im hopeing that my peppers will get there but i only ever seem to see one, i know they hide away a lot but its still got me nervous.
jamie
Setup looks brilliant mate, you'll need abit of time for the pods and stuff to grow and the SB to mature anyways. The refugium is connected to ure tank rite? if so its only doing your tank the world of good :D how are u pumping water up too it?
Are u sure you have both a male and female peppermint shrimps, if i recall correct the males have at least 1 huge pincer and the females don't? how big are ures? the ones i saw weere about 2-3 inch full size?
Cheers
Tom
hi mate, the water is pumped using a small pump in the tank and then just a bit of tubing into the tank.
peppermint shrimps to the best of my knowledge are
hermaphrodites so they should be ok, im going to get a few more of all my shrimps (cleaners and sexy) when i get my new tank up and running.
jamie
Hi jamie,
Great read. Glad to see someone is trying something different. Keep up the good work.
Pleased to see you are on the right side of the border!!
Mike.
thanks mike, glad people are finding it interesting, hopefully ill have something more interesting to post soon!
jamie
ok cool i wounder why the ones i saw were different then they were deffinetly peppermints???
When ure cleaners spawned hwo did u see the babies? my boxer and cleaner has so far produced eggs but i've not seen the off spring?
i waited up for a few nights when i knew they where due, when they spawn it nearly fills the whole tank with them but its in the dark so you have to be looking for them with a torch.
do you have a pic of the ones you saw?
jamie
i havn't seen any, when u see the eggs under the shrimp how long does it take before tey are released?
takes about 3-4 weeks they should change colour from green to what looks like a very dull cream then they will have a small black spot on them a couple of days before they hatch.
jamie
ok wicked cheers only realli noticed them while they were green, like u i only have one cleaner left. But only ever had 1 boxer and it produced eggs? my pepermint i hardly ever see so i wudn't know if it was producing eggs, he also doesn't like Apista's since i have 1 and he doesn't eat it dam him!
Tom
they will produce eggs on there own but they won't be fertile and should disappear in a few days
:D :D :D :D got my other cleaner shrimp today, hes acclimatising at the moment so keep your fingers crossed and hopefully we might have some more baby shrimp in a few months
cheers all
jamie
well that was a waste of £13 shrimp is getting eaten by my starfish as i type, really pi**ed off now, had it acclimatising by drip for about 2 1/2 hours but the usual story of seemed fine when it went in, then died.
this is why i prefer to buy from people breaking there tanks, then at least you know its been doing well and not on the way out when you get it.
damn it, back to square one again.
PYTHON2674
19-04-06, 13:09
Great thread, very intresting. My cleaners both as regular as clock work are stuffed full of eggs then release them. Only to be eaten by the other inmates.....Hey ho.
you should give raising them a go, very interesting.
jamie
this is a really interesting thread, I was led here because my shrimp have started regularly releasing eggs.
Jamie did you consider using an in-tank hang on hatchery of some sort? Just wondering if it would make things easier salinity & water change wise?
yes mate i did/am but im not sure if the lighting would have an effect on them?
ive got some peppers at the moment that spawn regularly so im going to give them a go and see what happens
jamie
yeah i didn't consider that, I need to read up more on it. Maybe it would be possible to mod the hatchery to diffuse enough light.
Would be interested to know how you get on with the peps, I have quite an outgoing pair but i've never noticed them carrying eggs.
DirtyHarry
26-10-06, 13:02
I have a breeding pair of Boxers, she released the larvae last night just after lights out. I managed to get around 40-50 and put them into one of my spare tanks in my garage. The tank contains a mix of phytoplankton, rotifiers and copepods that i feed to my mandarin. I'll let you know how they get on.
have you got any pics mate? also you might have some issues with water quality with all that food in there, have you read "raising and training peppermint shrimp" cant remember the authors name off the top of my head but she had a good idea about water quality in the initial stages of the fry, basically have a largish tank (2ft) filled to about 4" with the fry then over a week or two keep adding to the water every day thereby diluting(sp?) the toxins in the water.
oh and rotifiers might be to small, BBS are good if they seem to be struggling to feed.
Good luck
jamie
hi jamie sounds like your doing well mate :applause: my shrimp has got eggs aswell but dont no much about them they are green and been there for about three days i think how long does it take for theme to hatch please any imfo would be great. thanks
This is an old thread mate, Jamie hasn't even been online for 6 Months
15 dyas i think for them to lay
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