How to approach Quaratining

[Hardip]

Hi,

I need some advice on how to approach my quaratining of both existing and future live stock.


Some background
Display Tank - 125g with sand substrate and TS24 for flow;
Sump - 70g with majority of live rock, OR3500 return pump and 6080 circulation;
Fish Stock - Naso Tang, Diamond Goby, Snowflake Eel, Lemonpeel & Potters Dwarf Angel, Dogface Puffer, Porcupine Puffer, Longnosed Hawkfish and Yellow Tang.

I have around 100Kg of live rock with at least half that in the sump. There are a few pieces in the display tank, but have left it largely for the swimming space.

There are inverts in my system, but these will be removed so the system is purely FOWLR.


The problem
The trouble is with the notorious white spots. Unfortunately, I never really introduced a sensible Quaratining phase when I first got my tank. As a result, fish from time to time have shown the spots and the majority seem to be rid of it over time.

Both dwarf angels and tangs are void of any WS (the Naso was treated in the past, and has never shown signs of it since).

The Hawkfish and Goby has 1 or 2 dots on their pectorals but it has never gotten worse (or better). Both puffers have WS on their pectorals and Caudials (sic).

That said, all fish are eating fine, for the pigs that they are!


The questions
How long should I leave the display tank void of fish?
This would be an ideal oppurtunity to leave the main tank fishless, as I could house them all in various tanks in my QT area. But what is the minimum time that should be set out for the tank to remain without fish?

[B]Would it be worth chuck away the existing sand in the display tank and picking up fresh stuff?
Would replacing all the sand ensure any WS parasites that are embedded in the sand are done away with? New sand would probably be 1 bag of dead stuff and 1 small bag of live - just a thin layer for aesthetics.

Should copper treatment be applied to QT occupants, irrespective of signs?
Excluding copper-sensitive fish.

If I put my existing stock into QT, in the case of those that are not showing any signs of WS, should I treat them all with Copper as a precaution (would the parasites be able to attach but not show up)?

[jimmy911]

are you running a uv on your system i had the exact same thing since fitting the uv ive never had a problem also do you have cleaner shrimps present
i believe they should be the first live stock introduced im not trying to insult but somtimes what we think is the start of white spot is actualy a fungus or lam, as far as copper based goes, i would only recomend last resort for obvious stress reasons when i had this problem nothing would clear it and i was`nt confident with fresh water dipping and someone advised me to use,seachem cupramine,last resort remembering it needs to be done in a seperate hospital tank,, hope this makes sense and help you can always pm me mate like ive said i recently went though this fase lol

cheers tony

[Hardip]

I have a 25w TMC UV unit running 24/7 at the moment, with a maxijet 1700 providing the flow for it.

There are 5 cleaner shrimps* in my tank but they have had no impact on the white spot. Likewise, I've tried Garlic to no avail.


Cheers tony.


*they are lazy and don't seem bothered about cleaning.

[jacksok]

Rather than external treatments an alternative approach would be to try and boost the immune response of the fish. There have been some good reports from people following the TotalNutrition Aegis flake feeding regime. You'll find details here
http://www.new-era-aquaculture.com/prod-tn-aegis.html

HTH

Keith

[Hardip]

I already supplement their foods with the Liposome spray as well as giving them the Aegis flakes. Almost finished the first stage (week 4).

[Kev s]

Another question to ask would be do any of the panel qt their stock if they don't then this isn't the place to ask!!

Proper Qt tanks are pretty rare really but a good idea if you have the time, money and space.

Kev

[Hardip]

I have the space. The only issues I'd have with it would be the additional efforts in maintenance (in between uses). From recent threads and advice given, I've interpreted that much to be minimal as it is suggested just keeping a suitably-sized sponge filter in the sump active would eliminate the need to keep a QT active 24/7.

[instantsquid]

I'm currently running my quarantine tank full time after a complete wipe-out. Basically, because I lost most of my stock, I'm going to be adding fish one or two at a time for the foreseeable future.
It's a fairly typical setup - small tank, furnished with some flower pots and non-live rock to give the fish a bit of cover. Filtration is provided by an over-sized external Eheim. Water changes are performed using the main tank's water to acclimatise the fish.
And that's it really - four weeks in quarantine, if the fish remain 100% healthy with no sign of illness then they're moved into the main tank. If a fish does show any signs of disease, it'll be treated in the quarantine tank.

HTH - Ian.

[Wombat]

but sometimes what we think is the start of white spot is actually a fungus or lam, as far as copper based goes,


Fungal diseases are very rare in marine fish and when they occur they tend to be internal fungal diseases like Icthyophonous. Your comments may be quite true in freshwater but don't really hold true (IMHO) for marine fish.

Also what do you mean by lam?

[simon garratt]

Probably 'the' most important Q any long term ws sufferer should ask themselves is 'why' they get it, and why they cant shift it.

Admittedly there are a few strains that come through from time to time that can be very tenacious, but its still shouldnt be that difficult for average outbreaks to die out by themselves if the system and stock are well managed and desighned with the fishes needs taken into consideration both biologically and surprisingly 'mentaly'...

Probably the most common factors ive witnessed where stubburn infections are encounterd are as follows.

1. poor diet, lack of food in general, innefective feeding regimes (anthias/tangs getting 1 big feed a day rather than several smaller feeds) or a system that cant handle the demand of food nessesery to keep the stock it has. (most keepers underfeed, and are very surprised when they see just how fat a health Tang should be and how much food you 'can' put through a well desighned system)

2. Poor environment, ie water quality, accessive pH drift, dump feeding leading to ammonia spikes, Poor levels of 02 saturation.

3. Poor environment. ie exessive lighting periods, size to volume ratio to exessive (no free swimming space). Incompatible mixes, ie several different tangs in too smaller space. constant changes to the tank layout, or new additions.

4. simply poor stock choice at time of purchase. thin or emaciated purchases, or damage from bullying leading to mental problems from the start.

5 External influances. noisy surroundings leading to exessive vibtrations in the tank, load bangs etc. Constant big ugly face pressed against the glass stressing the new fish out.

6. Residual / seepage current from poorly fitted/sealed tube lights etc. (not proven, but quite logically a constant irritation to the fish and its sensetive lateral system)

I honestly dont think its possible to keep WS out of any mixed system regardless of quarentining proceedures. although i do condone the practice.

The real focus of attention in most cases ime is simply running a good system with logical stock choice, vigelence at the time of purchase, and then trying to make thier captive lifespan as comfortable and as stable as possible. Its inevitable in many cases that new introductions come down with a minor case of the infection, iether from background traces in your own tank, or carrying it allready, but in most of the cases ive seen where the fish is put into a well managed system, this passes quickly with no long term hassles. In many cases i think people panic just a little too much and tamper insesantly rather than keeping things to normal routines and letting the fsh sort itself out without intervention.

Regards

Si.

[wayne in norway]

If I was in your position I would QT everything for 6 weeks. It is a faff, but the peace of mind is marvellous. I tried 'letting the fsh sort itself out without intervention' on two occasions when I saw ich, and not sandgrains or marine snow on the fins, and had two wipeouts. Never again.