View Full Version : Looking for a new camera, but which one?
Okay, I really cannot show off my tank, without a good camera to take the photos with can I?
So, the time has come to get a "proper" camera, not a phone camera, an DSLR
What are your recommendations?
I've been looking at certain Canon's
300D
400D
450D
And the Nikon D40x, as recommended by The Gadget Show.
What are views on the above cameras?
My budget, will be roughly £400. I'm looking to get into photography, as a "Hobby" or a career to fall back on, if I don't find something else! I honestly have no idea!
Look forward to the replies
Ben
My team has a dozen cameras between us, some Canon some Nikkon, Apart from my own bias they are much of a muchness (dont let them hear me say that!) If you can go a lilttle more go for the Canon EOS 40D, litte more ££ LOT more camera. Noise levels even at exceptionally high ISO are FANTASTIC.
If you can push your budget a little more go for the Canon £629.99 inc Vat (Jessops price) plus there is a voucher for a further £60.00 back from Canon. The 0s tend to be a bit better than the 00s, they are aimed more for the proffesional, if you want it to be used for a career. Alex
Or Park Cameras (recomended) for £600 with 60 cashback :)
Or Park Cameras (recomended) for £600 with 60 cashback :)
even betterer, if I was to start singing on these pages, do you think i could raise enaough dosh to buy me one??? :whistling::whistling::whistling: Alex
not if you sing anything like me!
Right so the 450D is the one to have then?
Thanks Guys
I'm sure I can find it cheaper than £630 though...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&Item=130248899834&Category=31388&_trksid=p3907.m29
Or in silver ;)
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-CANON-EOS-REBEL-XSI-450D-DIGITAL-SLR-CAMERA-KIT-4GB_W0QQitemZ120296607493QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item1 20296607493&_trkparms=39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A16|240%3A1308&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
Alan Gabriel
22-08-08, 22:40
Right so the 450D is the one to have then?
Thanks Guys
I'm sure I can find it cheaper than £630 though...
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&Item=130248899834&Category=31388&_trksid=p3907.m29
As with all technology, it will be outdated by Christmas and half the price :laugh:
no! The 40D is the one to have! (00's bad, 0's Good, thus 400\450 bad, 40 good!) They are all good cameras though mate, But if you are looking for a career option then this is a much better camera. I have a 40D & often see press & Pros using them from sports to doorstepping.
No £60 cashback from flebay......
Oh the 40D
My bad.
Will get searching now :D
Is it good for coral shoots too? :)
No £60 cashback from flebay......
Yeah, but I save £150+ by buying from there.
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Canon-EOS-40D-DSLR-UK-Ver-Body-Kit-Bat-6Gifts-2wty_W0QQitemZ130246879534QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item 130246879534&_trkparms=39%3A1|66%3A2|65%3A16|240%3A1318&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
;)
Whoops, no Lenses with that one.
Your right, Jessops is the way forward ;)
Don't save anything buying from eBay, plus I get £60 back.
Right, so any of you 40D owners, can you show me some pics? :D
Coral shots, all shots... But this is where you get into the real money - Lens's......... Get the best you can afford. Birthdays & Xmas etc etc! If you get the 40D there is a lot to tweak you will get some stunning pics with some time and patience.
Awesome, but the lenses is where I get confused.
all the 18-55mm, whats all that then?
Ahh, this is where Canon are really good - help and education. simply put your zoom.
Check this : http://www.canon.co.uk/For_Home/Product_Finder/Cameras/EF_Lenses/focal_length_comparison.asp
This shows the same view through different lens's
Ahh, this is where Canon are really good - help and education. simply put your zoom.
Check this : http://www.canon.co.uk/For_Home/Product_Finder/Cameras/EF_Lenses/focal_length_comparison.asp
This shows the same view through different lens's
Thats awesome!
Really helpful, thanks.
Does it go like, the higher the length, the higher the price?
Many different aspcts to price. Quality of Glass, No of Blades, size of apature. Prime are usually better than zoom (fixed focal length) L Series are Superb IMO, choice in general of professionals. But they are expensive and HEAVY! I would maybe get a Sigma wide (10 to 20) as Canon dont really do a very good wide. A prime - Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II, pretty good and stupid cheap, then think about how far you want to shoot with a zoom.
The one I really want is: Canon EF 85mm f1.2L II USM - $$$$ but OMG its something else.
Holy crap thats alot for a lense!
Basically, I'd want a good wide lense, along with a good Macro, for closer shots, mainly of corals ;)
Its gunna be a while before I get the camera yet, Xmas probably.
If I get 10 A's at GCSE, then thats - 10 x £75 = £750
So thats my budget, but tbh, I'm doubtful about the 10 A's :lol:
Good Luck! Not really got into Macro (next on the list) But from the Canon side the Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 is the one of choice.
Yep, just looking at that on Canon's site.
We'll see how it goes, but if I can afford, the 40D is the one at the moment.
But by Xmas, they might be a load of new, better cameras out! As Alan said earlier on :)
Just a thought but have you thought about the sonys? Just been doing research into DSLR's myself as im off to the states next week and the new sony's, especially the A350, have had amazing reviews....better than the canon 400/450's and nikon d60...The live view function is the best on the the market. Only downside to them is there are currently fewer compatable lenses, but they are new to this sector so i expect this to change.
Holy crap thats alot for a lense!
Basically, I'd want a good wide lense, along with a good Macro, for closer shots, mainly of corals ;)
Its gunna be a while before I get the camera yet, Xmas probably.
If I get 10 A's at GCSE, then thats - 10 x £75 = £750
So thats my budget, but tbh, I'm doubtful about the 10 A's :lol:
Sigma Lenes are pretty good, and they do not cost as much as the Canon ones, to start with perhaps go for them, if you decide youare wanting to make money from photography, then invest in better quality lenses, you could look on fleabay, for second hand lenses, just make sure you have the right lens though, have you thought of doing a degree in something like Photomedia, you could then legitimately put the camera down as REQUIRED equipment :laugh:. Alex
In all honesty I'd go for the 450D and put the money you save against a dedicated Macro lens such as the Tamron 90mm.
Yes the 40D has better build quality and handling but it's the lens and the guy holding the camera that make the real difference.
oh and as for buying at Jessops. Not unless you wan to pay WAY over the odds. Do a search on eBay for a seller called Kerso (Ian Kerr). I've spent 000's with him on Canon gear and never had a problem. I've also saved a packet on the prices Jessops etc sell at!
And to add to that even though its through ebay, you can claim cashback with him. Great guy and service. :thumbsup:
And Aep, no need to put him off the whole xxxD line like that saying they're bad. Yeah they're not as good as the xxD and above series' and I would love to have a 40D for the noise but like yourself and Nath said, the glass is where its at, so when he has a limited budget he would get much more bang for his buck for coral macros getting say...400D/450D/1000D(havnt heard much about that really!) plus a tamron 90mm or canon 100mm macro, compared to being stuck with a 40D and just the kit lens, especially since being under 16 doubt he will have that much money to upgrade in the near future.
Jeff.
and I wouldn't discount the Nikon d40, d40x or perhaps the new d60. You can get d40s for a really good price at the moment and as jeff and nath say you can then buy yourself a nice macro lens. A decent tripod (essential) and flashgun will also eat into your budget but will transform your photography.
Look at the reviews on the net and try the cameras out in a shop - they are all different shapes and sizes and it needs to feel right for you.
I keep thinking I should trade my d40 in for a d300 but if I'm honest I don't think my camera is the limiting factor at the moment - it's my ability and that won't suddenly change just cos I've got a better camera!
HTH and good luck
Neil
:)
In all honesty I'd go for the 450D and put the money you save against a dedicated Macro lens such as the Tamron 90mm.
Yes the 40D has better build quality and handling but it's the lens and the guy holding the camera that make the real difference.
Thanks Nathan, this was what I was thinking about doing, before I got the 40D
Tamron 90mm, will research that, see wheres best to buy it from :)
Thanks again.
and I wouldn't discount the Nikon d40, d40x or perhaps the new d60. You can get d40s for a really good price at the moment and as jeff and nath say you can then buy yourself a nice macro lens. A decent tripod (essential) and flashgun will also eat into your budget but will transform your photography.
Look at the reviews on the net and try the cameras out in a shop - they are all different shapes and sizes and it needs to feel right for you.
I keep thinking I should trade my d40 in for a d300 but if I'm honest I don't think my camera is the limiting factor at the moment - it's my ability and that won't suddenly change just cos I've got a better camera!
HTH and good luck
Neil
:)
Spanner in the works now with lots of choice. Thought I was set on the 40D, but tbh, I can't justify the high cost!
Nothing to do with what you said, but whats RAW files?
Flashguns? Are they a necessity?
And of cause a tripod, any suggestions as to which one?
Thanks for the input
Ben
And to add to that even though its through ebay, you can claim cashback with him. Great guy and service. :thumbsup:
Really? Thats great news. Thanks :D
And Aep, no need to put him off the whole xxxD line like that saying they're bad. Yeah they're not as good as the xxD and above series' and I would love to have a 40D for the noise but like yourself and Nath said, the glass is where its at, so when he has a limited budget he would get much more bang for his buck for coral macros getting say...400D/450D/1000D(havnt heard much about that really!) plus a tamron 90mm or canon 100mm macro, compared to being stuck with a 40D and just the kit lens, especially since being under 16 doubt he will have that much money to upgrade in the near future.
Jeff.
And yeah, for the same price as a 450D, + Plus good macro, I get the standard 40D with no lens. I can't see the benefit, apart from this "noise". Can you explaining please? :thumbsup:
Thanks Jeff
Ben
You've probably seen previous posts re this but onestop-digital is well worth looking at for lenses.
The tamron is £206 vs £370 from jessops.
Cheers
Neil
http://www.onestop-digital.com/catalog/
One-stop digital, nope, never read about them.
Thats a big difference in price!
Thanks :)
No problem
tripod - don't know which are best (i've got a velbon from jessops that cost about £50 - a present so i didn't research) but like everything else in photography (and reefs!) there is no upper limit to what you can pay.
Flashgun - although the camera might come with a pop up flash a decent flashgun will make your portrait shots much better (assuming you aren't going to just use your camera for tank shots). Whether you need a flash for your tank depends on how much light you've got above the tank. I've got 2x150w halides above a 4 foot (18 inch depth) tank and whilst I can take shots without a flash of slow moving stuff like corals I can't get a high enough shutter speed for the fish without using my flash. A flash means that you don't have to increase the ISO (the higher the ISO the more grainy the shot) or increase the aperture (the more you increase the aperture - which is a lower f number - the less depth of field you get).
RAW is a file format the camera uses - basically RAW means the file stores all the information that the camera's sensor captures. Whereas JPEG files compress the data to make the file size smaller. Shooting in RAW means that you can manipulate the pictures more in programmes like photoshop. The only downside of RAW is that the files are quite large which means that your computer's hard drive gets filled up.
HTH
Neil
:)
PS the experts will now hopefully explain these things properly!
Now we delve into the confusing part of photography! Aperture, etc :blush: I'll learn ;)
Hmm, I'm pretty good with PS, so RAW files will be a must :D
We'll see what happens memory wise, you say large, but how big?
5mb+ per pic?
My current camera, well phone, Nokia N95, gets 1mb+ pics, even 2 for high res shots, so they must be pretty good! ;)
Thanks again Neil
Very helpful.
Dont be led astray Canon, Canon, Canon :p
Tripod, I have a Manfrotto (pro tripod, light and great but $$$) I also have a silly cheap one and I rate it very highly, much the same as you get in the high St. for about the £50 mark but £11. It holds my 40D with a whopping 70-200 f/2.8L series & 580EX flash gun. So its got the cahoonies to do the job and its pretty light
http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=777_1&products_id=99654
Dont be put off wiht how cheap it is!
Reef bloke
23-08-08, 22:08
The 40d is great camera( i own one) but... there isnt any point buying a more expensive and feature rich camera if you get lost in the extra settings.The 400 and 450d's maybe entry DLSR's but they are a world away from compact cameras and are serious bits of kit if used correctly.
Id save your money for you lens collections and get a 400d,you can always upgrade the camera but lenses can last a life time.
The 40D has all the options at your fingertips (ISO, WB, Aperture, metering etc) my old 350 you needed to go into darn menus for everything - So I changed noting! I just found it so much more fiddly to use. But as I may have said before. I think the order of importance is Photographer, lens, camera. If you dont have an eye for photography then all the gear in the world wont help! Sadly there is a massive jump between to 30 & 40D so you dont get the chance to have last weeks model!
One thing to think of though with brand - You cant use a Nikkon Lens on a Canon body (or Sony etc) When you have your collection of ££££'s lenses you are stuck with the same brand. Just something to think of when buying your Canon (the right choice!)
Reef bloke
23-08-08, 22:28
I must say i prefer the Canon lens line up to the Nikon.If it werent for the great Canon lenses i might just be tempted over to the dark side.
Dont tell anyone.. But same for me :)
Reef bloke
23-08-08, 22:34
;)
Lukechromis
24-08-08, 12:27
Onestop is great. I just paid £280 for a tamron 90mm macro and kenko converter 1.4x. It all came within 4 days from HK and free delivery.
That is over £200 less than jessops.
I am well impressed weith them and will be getting ym new 40D from them which is super cheap too.:D
To be honest if you can get a 400d new (which is hard now because of the 450d) get the 400 and save the money for a lense. The 450 has 2 MP better but this is only really noticed if you blow it up to poster size prints.
I have the 400 too but with wildlife photography a 40d is better and i need 2 cameras for macro and wildlife so i don't have to keep switching lenses.
Tah,
Luke
The 450D is the one to go for for many reasons.
1. it's the best of the current crop of budget DSLR's. just read a magazine review of 450D, d60, sonyA350, pentax 200d, olympus 510. Canon came out on top by a wide margin.
2. 12mb is the minimum res for stock library shots.
3. save money on camera to spend on lenses, saying the 40D is better is crap it has the same autofocus system and digic III processor, it's better built and has a faster FPS but that's less important than a good lens. esp for a first DSLR. i'm on my 4th DSLR in 5 years but still using some lenses that are 20 years old.
4. the most important reason, it's currently £430 from warehouse express with a card and camera bag.
http://www.warehouseexpress.com/product/default.aspx?sku=10000139&go=kits_bundles
if you want a laugh have a look at the price of the 1000d
Roddy
Lukechromis
24-08-08, 13:20
It all depends on what you want it for. If it is just for all round stuff go for the 450 or 400d.
I do wildlife photography and the 40d is better for that faster fps etc.
Thanks,
Luke
It all depends on what you want it for. If it is just for all round stuff go for the 450 or 400d.
I do wildlife photography and the 40d is better for that faster fps etc.
Thanks,
Luke
Don't get me wrong i agree the 40D is a better camera just not if your 16 and on a budget, Bodies go out of date every 18months, lenses don't and have a much greater impact on image quality. Even if he decides to pursue photography as a Pro the 450D would become a nice spare body in 2-3 years time when he can buy a 6D or whatever the full sensors are up to by then.
Roddy
i have the 450D and think its great :thumbsup: simple to use too which is great if you are a beginer like me :o
The 450D is the one to go for for many reasons.
1. it's the best of the current crop of budget DSLR's. just read a magazine review of 450D, d60, sonyA350, pentax 200d, olympus 510. Canon came out on top by a wide margin.
Depending on what reviews you read obviously!! The last 3 group reviews ive read have put the canon and sony joint top with the other 3 brands just under them. None of top 5 brands recieved less than 85%, with the canon and sony both averaging 90-92%....
Sounds like the 450D is a good beginner choice.
I spoke to Dad about the 40D, and he says its just too much. So its the 450D by the sounds of it, which is still good :D
And I think to begin with, it'll be just General photography, a few wildlife shots, tank shots, so a Macro lens, and maybe a wide angle lens, are the first ones I'll buy.
Thanks for all the help guys :)
sounds like a good starting point Ben those are the two lenses i went for, you could go crazy with lenses but i was on a bit of a budget and did not want to go OTT
Manfrotto are the pro's choice of tripod. I, me, just me personally used to the official main UK service person for manfrotto for around 2 1/2 yrs.
They come in carbon fibre if you have plenty.
If you can wait there will be some great deals on the 40D soon as the rumours are now starting on the impending release of the 50D.
Lukechromis
24-08-08, 20:52
Don't get me wrong i agree the 40D is a better camera just not if your 16 and on a budget, Bodies go out of date every 18months, lenses don't and have a much greater impact on image quality. Even if he decides to pursue photography as a Pro the 450D would become a nice spare body in 2-3 years time when he can buy a 6D or whatever the full sensors are up to by then.
Roddy
I'm 16 too.:D But i have a job which i save the money from and i spend more money on photography than reefs.:thumbsup:
Thanks,
Luke
Not considered the Sony? I have the Minolta Dslr which became Sony. The advantages it has is ultra low noise at high ISO, second hand lenses are generally a little cheaper, Sony optics are second to none, and the DSLR range has anti-shake. It's true that anti-shake lenses are available for canon and nikon, but for one they are heavier than standard lenses, and secondly they tend to be very expensive.
Just a thought.
I had a Canon Eos 10d, then had a Nikon D70 before getting my Minolta. It suited my needs for low light photography and I also preferred the ergonomics and menu system. I'm in no way knocking Canon, Nikon, Pentax, etc, instead I'd advise checking out other makes and models before deciding. Try steves-digicams.com as there are great forums and reviews.
Ive tried mentioning the Sony's but it seems to have fallen on deaf ears! Despite the amazing live view system and the fact that the actual camera body supports anti shake meaning no need for USM lenses as the canon or nikon rely on , there seems to be little support for them on this thread....Maybe just because they are so new and people are stuck in their ways.... (Must go canon because they have a 'Name') Never mind, I know what im getting when i get to Vegas in a week.....
It hasn't fallen on Deaf ears, I'm taking it all in, but like I say, it will be xmas before I get it, but I want to make sure I get the BEST I can afford.
Whether thats Sony, Canon, Nikon, whatever, I will be going to a shop, and trying these out, before I part with my cash, so every little helps from you guys.
Reef bloke
25-08-08, 00:33
Sony have come on in leaps and bounds over the past 6 months or so.Personally i prefer the Canon lens line up plus the Sony lenses seem a bit more expensive than the Canon L equivalent,I'm also not sure i like the quirkly camera design.
Also Jordlr do you mean I.S/O.S lenses rather than USM?Regarding the Live view im not sure the live view system on say the a350 would suit me.As far as im aware the sony live view uses a secondary sensor so you dont have to flip the mirror for AF,while this is more convenient than the Canon 40d's live view you cant magnify the image in camera for better manual focusing.I use Live view for macro so i find the magnification capability of the 40d's live view invaluable.Dont get me wrong the Sony live view system is technically superior but the above would be a real chink in its armour for me.
Sony have come on in leaps and bounds over the past 6 months or so.Personally i prefer the Canon lens line up plus the Sony lenses seem a bit more expensive than the Canon L equivalent,I'm also not sure i like the quirkly camera design.
Also Jordlr do you mean I.S/O.S lenses rather than USM?Regarding the Live view im not sure the live view system on say the a350 would suit me.As far as im aware the sony live view uses a secondary sensor so you dont have to flip the mirror for AF,while this is more convenient than the Canon 40d's live view you cant magnify the image in camera for better manual focusing.I use Live view for macro so i find the magnification capability of the 40d's live view invaluable.Dont get me wrong the Sony live view system is technically superior but the above would be a real chink in its armour for me.
To be honest im not completly sure where the live view on the sony stands regarding the magnification capabilty....i thought it did have this function because as you say it does use a secondary sensor for the live view, making it behave like a compact, in the fact that the screen focuses as fast as it would in the view finder as well as zooming in and the screen rotating for when shooting high/low shots...I'll be able to confirm what functions its capable of when i get back from the states with one (£330 with lens over there) but this is how it reads in the reviews/tech details ive read. Also regarding the lenses, i think the standard sony one's are on a par with standard canon ones regarding cost, its just the carl zeiss ones that cost a fortune...also tamron and sigma are starting to make their lenses in the A-mount system for sonys as well as the standard fit for canon/nikon so they must have a fairly high confidence in the format to consider this.
At the end of the day i think Benb has his head screwed on and is approaching this in the right manner. You need to read as many magazine and internet reviews as possible, then go to the shop and handle the product itself and make the decission thats best for you and not what other people try to make you think is best :thumbsup:
Look here for reviews... http://www.whatdigitalcamera.com/equipment/Digital%20SLR/738/index.php
Personally I don't think any major manufacturer produces a 'bad' camera. Regarding Sony, keep in mind that the Alpha range comes from Minolta. The 5D from Minolta became the Alpha100 when Sony bought Minolta so there's a lot of pedigree there and the Minolta lenses, and all the Sigmas and Tamrons that fitted the minoltas will work with Sony (auto lenses only) so there is a big choice of lenses. Most will tell you that Minolta faves like the 70-210F4 beercan and the 85mm F1.4 are truly great lenses. Many Minolta lenses can be bought for a song too.
For me the low light and anti-shake were my decision to buy. Like all cameras, and a bit like choosing a maring tank, you need to decide what to do and how much you can afford.
I'm sure whatever make you go with you'll be happy. I liked my Canon and Nikon, and if I bought a camera again, who knows what I'd buy....Actually it'd be a Sony as I have all those lenses. :laugh:
Lukechromis
25-08-08, 19:10
Jessops are offering £60 cashback on 40d at the mo so it is around £560 mark.:D
i would seriously save your money and just buy a second hand fuji s7000 takes amazing shots and great macro shots with no extra equipment
i would seriously save your money and just buy a second hand fuji s7000 takes amazing shots and great macro shots with no extra equipment
Rory has a good point if you cant afford to buy extra lenses then a good bridge is a better choice. However i would go for the Fuji S1000fd myself. Mate at work has one and it's a great camera 10Mp 12x zoom Etc. £183 from warehouse express. spend another £60+ or so on a decent tripod and your good to go.
Roddy
Rory has a good point if you cant afford to buy extra lenses then a good bridge is a better choice. However i would go for the Fuji S1000fd myself. Mate at work has one and it's a great camera 10Mp 12x zoom Etc. £183 from warehouse express. spend another £60+ or so on a decent tripod and your good to go.
Roddy
These cameras are all good cameras, but if you want your photography equipment to "expand" DO NOT buy a fixed lens camera I'm not knocking them), if you want to make moeny in the photography game, then it has to be a SLR type of camera, pm me your address, i will send you a couple of digi photography books (may be out dated digi is pushing the barrier al the time) they may help you get started.
Everybody has their fav make, mine happens to be Canon, back when you were a babe in arms, it was all film, and then my camera of choice was an Olympus, things change, if you are going to put your priceless camera on three sticks you had better make sure it is strong enough to hold it, so Manfrotto againis my choice, I have had mne 12 years it has held my Hasselblad, my 5" X 4" camera, they are superb, perhaps you could look for a second hand Canon D20, great camera (what I use) the next boggest expense is going to be the Flash, look at Hammer Head style, Metz, do not stick a flash centrally, you will find side mounted far better. Hope this all helps, by now you have probably got a serious headach, serves you right asking people their opinion of camera choice!!! Alex
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