Sales Dept on strike?

[neil_1978_0]

Sent a few emails now and still no reply??!!:( Even spoke with you Steve earlier and you said that the sales dept are replying to your emails. . . . . .just not mine?:rolleyes:

Neil

[neil_1978_0]

Hi,

received the o ring today, badly packed and overchared in terms of P&P. Thank you for your continuous communication throughout my minor ordeal. Good to know you can rely on some during a crisis!!! :rolleyes:

On a plus point. . . .all the other sponsors I have had dealings with have been spot on!

[disco_dave]

Neil what size was the oring....i have a box of orings all sizes here.

[neil_1978_0]

Neil what size was the oring....i have a box of orings all sizes here.

Mate,

Have it now, there was one on there but not the original so it seems hence the leak so think it was best to have the original. However. . . . . . If it happens again I would use an elastic band than go through their customer support. Awful mate!! Thank god I don't have much deltec equip!! :D

[disco_dave]

no problem...i actual have an elastic band in calcium reactor pump to stop it leaking does the the trick.

Dave

[Dami]

Hi,

all the other sponsors I have had dealings with have been spot on!

with the exception of 1 :whistling::)

[D-D Spares]

glad you got it sorted.

Andy
D-D

[Stuart Bertram]

Neil
Out of interest how much was the postage and packing on the O ring

Stuart

[Stuart Bertram]

I see there has been no reply to my question so I will answer it myself - the postage was £1.50.

D-D are a distribution company who supply to retail stores only and do not normally supply goods direct to the public.

Spare parts are available from any of 400+ retail shops up and down the country however you will find that most stores do not carry spares and therefore there will be a delay in obtaining potentially urgent parts from them.

About 3 years ago I identified this problem and started supplying parts direct to the hobbyist to speed up and improve the availability. How many other companies in this hobby offer such a service?

The O ring cost you about £1.20. The postage was £1.50 of which the postage was 56p and the envelope about 20p. On top of that as you paid by paypal there were paypal charges and Andy had to travel to the post office to post it to you plus the couple of reply emails sent.

At the time we were out of stock of this O ring and so to help you out we stripped down a complete pump to ensure you got it quickly.

So to recap - we have run around after you travelled out to the post office to help you out and save you having leave your computer and to go to your retailer and you complain about a total bill of £2.70.

If others find this service so bad and such a rip off then I am happy to stop it tomorrow because I can guarantee that it costs us both time and money to provide you with this easy access to spare parts.

Fortunately there are sufficient people who understand how hard we work to help the hobby which makes it worth while.

Stuart

[Dami]

i'll be fair to Stuart on this one, may times over the years D-D sent me spares, bearings, etc by post, sent same day, to my home, except they were free :).
so the service there is probably good!

[Bradden]

I would just like to say that I've always found your service 1st class.

[neil_1978_0]

I see there has been no reply to my question so I will answer it myself - the postage was £1.50.

D-D are a distribution company who supply to retail stores only and do not normally supply goods direct to the public.

Spare parts are available from any of 400+ retail shops up and down the country however you will find that most stores do not carry spares and therefore there will be a delay in obtaining potentially urgent parts from them.

About 3 years ago I identified this problem and started supplying parts direct to the hobbyist to speed up and improve the availability. How many other companies in this hobby offer such a service?

The O ring cost you about £1.20. The postage was £1.50 of which the postage was 56p and the envelope about 20p. On top of that as you paid by paypal there were paypal charges and Andy had to travel to the post office to post it to you plus the couple of reply emails sent.

At the time we were out of stock of this O ring and so to help you out we stripped down a complete pump to ensure you got it quickly.

So to recap - we have run around after you travelled out to the post office to help you out and save you having leave your computer and to go to your retailer and you complain about a total bill of £2.70.

If others find this service so bad and such a rip off then I am happy to stop it tomorrow because I can guarantee that it costs us both time and money to provide you with this easy access to spare parts.

Fortunately there are sufficient people who understand how hard we work to help the hobby which makes it worth while.

Stuart



Firstly, may I say it’s quite frustrating when no one gets back to you Stuart don’t you think? You proposed you question approx 9hrs before answering it yourself. I had to wait in excess of 2 days, even after a phone call to you in which you advised me that your emails were being responded to from the sales dept! If you placed a greater focus on answering customers’ original emails as opposed to responding defensively to customers 'honest' experiences then I am sure this would greatly improve your customer service.

Secondly, I find it difficult to believe that a global company such as yours pays 20p for an individual envelope and not bulk buy to save costs, especially now as you have placed grater emphasis on the postal issue of replacement parts. The envelope received was brown taped as it clearly had been used prior to me receiving it. Although I must commend your company for its 'green' approach, something which I wish other companies placed greater emphasis on.

The O ring. . . . £1.20!? It’s a washer!! Nothing more, nothing less. I am sure anyone who has ever browsed around a well known hardware store can vouch that these are pennies!! Having paid so much for the reactor itself 9and we all know how much the PF501 costs) I think £1.20 is a little excessive for a washer. May I label the point that I am not overly concerned regarding the cost, my issue was the lack IMO of customer service and it is my right to voice my concern regarding this.

I do not wish to get into a slanging match as I feel this serves no purpose other than to provide entertainment for others. Having read similar threads posted by others to sponsors on here, I see there is a mixed response to ‘criticism’ some take this on board and make necessary adjustments if needed, others become somewhat defensive.

An example of customer service. . . . .

I previously had an issue with my skimmer pump on my Red Sea Max 130. Spoke with intrapet and had a replacement pump sent within 48hrs free of charge! Why? Customer service I expect.

As I mentioned, I am not into 'freebies' and I by no way judge customer service by cost. This hobby is expensive and I am prepared to pay for the best equipment available. Although I personally believe that with a price tag comes responsibility from that company to provide customer service

I feel your company failed to do this! To me this matter is closed.

Rant over :annoyed:

MODS - Feel free to remove this thread should the sponsor believe my comments are derogative and destructive.


Kind regards

Neil

[curlys_new_tank]

I know Neil and hes a nice guy and isn't worried about the money. I think its the way he was treated :p. But Neil we have to understand that some people are busy.


PS marine fish are supposed to be relaxing. But if something gos wrong like a few pounds o ring could cost thousands then its not that relaxing ;)
:thanks:

[Stuart Bertram]

Neil

We get so many emails every day from global customers that it is not always possible to answer them all immediately. At one point last week I had 110 emails to answer and after answering them all day still had about 90. Not because I had only answered 20 but because there had been another 30 that had come in on top of that.

I have a concern that not all of the emails are getting through our server as today I had a report from Canada that our man there was not recieving all of his mail - I am looking in to that and you should also look into your spam box for possible replies.

Re your other comments - £1.20 for an O ring may seem expensive to you however this part is made by Aquabee who are a completely independant company and I cannot comment on their pricing policy other than to say that the same o ring from Eheim is at least another £10.

A cup of coffee in a cafe costs perhaps £2.50. This is not the cost of the coffee but the cost of the infrastructure to allow you to be able to sit and drink it. It is the same with spare parts as there are costs involved to make it easily available to the end user that go well beyond the cost of a ring of rubber.

If people realised how hard our small team of people work on their own time to assist the hobbyist you would realise why I get so defensive of their hard work.

This is nothing personal but if someone attacks our hard work then we should be allowed to fight back.

Stuart

[neil_1978_0]

Neil

We get so many emails every day from global customers that it is not always possible to answer them all immediately. At one point last week I had 110 emails to answer and after answering them all day still had about 90. Not because I had only answered 20 but because there had been another 30 that had come in on top of that.

I have a concern that not all of the emails are getting through our server as today I had a report from Canada that our man there was not recieving all of his mail - I am looking in to that and you should also look into your spam box for possible replies.
Stuart

Stuart,

I appreciate and thank you for your explinations as to the possible reasons behind the delay in answering my emails

Neil

[curlys_new_tank]

:friends::friends::teehee::surrender:
THATS IT GUYS KISS AND MAKE UP :p

[aqualityplace]

i'll be fair to Stuart on this one, may times over the years D-D sent me spares, bearings, etc by post, sent same day, to my home, except they were free :).
so the service there is probably good!

Your very lucky :) this company is a bully in my opinion. Got a bit to big for their boots - unforunatly their products are good and better than the competition - always the way

[Dami]

Unfortunately mike, they own the companies, the factories, the brands, the products and are free to do as they like, a case of fit in....or f..... off.
The attitude has been extended hard in the uk. Many customers have been put off, many outlets holding accounts with D-D have spoken freely that they have experienced sour times from D-D, the times have changed. Clearly they must have bigger fish to fry here..... (excuse the pun!)
In truth too many have experienced the rough end of them over the last 18 months...
We are unfortunately unable to write freely about details regarding these issue due to the fact that they are sponsors, they will be supported regardless....

D-D cannot continue to justify their ridiculous price hikes to the general masses, even the letters send out to retailers justifying these are nonsense. i do the maths, the raw materals, the fuels, labours, excesses, shipping marketing etc. doesn't make sense, unless of course someone owes the bank manager........?! :whistling:
The only saving grace is the Wolfgang substantially over engineered the products, making them last longer as a result, be hardier, and have a real feeling of weight and quality. Without this D-D would never exist.
Many of us feel Deltec would have been in a very different market if Terry, or others had been able to secure what David did with the company. It is with great regret though that i doubt anything has affected their sales globaly. but i know now (still counting too!) of around £27,000 in lost sales that have directly arisen from recent times with D-D, around £3400 was from me alone.
I'm staring down the barrel again of another much needed investment with them again, but lack any interest in doing so.... just as much as the retailers lack the interest in making the orders too.......
Really to much to chew over here......

However my comments still stand, historically they have shown a good level of customer service and help, with some resonable advise and assistance to many over the years, i imagine it must wear thin though, years of the same silly questions, the same endless quotes and the same infuriating people!

So perhaps something to justify their maddness.......

(spelling is apalling of course!:D)

[neil_1978_0]

my work here is done!

[aqualityplace]

Unfortunately mike, they own the companies, the factories, the brands, the products and are free to do as they like, a case of fit in....or f..... off.
The attitude has been extended hard in the uk. Many customers have been put off, many outlets holding accounts with D-D have spoken freely that they have experienced sour times from D-D, the times have changed. Clearly they must have bigger fish to fry here..... (excuse the pun!)
In truth too many have experienced the rough end of them over the last 18 months...
We are unfortunately unable to write freely about details regarding these issue due to the fact that they are sponsors, they will be supported regardless....

D-D cannot continue to justify their ridiculous price hikes to the general masses, even the letters send out to retailers justifying these are nonsense. i do the maths, the raw materals, the fuels, labours, excesses, shipping marketing etc. doesn't make sense, unless of course someone owes the bank manager........?! :whistling:
The only saving grace is the Wolfgang substantially over engineered the products, making them last longer as a result, be hardier, and have a real feeling of weight and quality. Without this D-D would never exist.
Many of us feel Deltec would have been in a very different market if Terry, or others had been able to secure what David did with the company. It is with great regret though that i doubt anything has affected their sales globaly. but i know now (still counting too!) of around £27,000 in lost sales that have directly arisen from recent times with D-D, around £3400 was from me alone.
I'm staring down the barrel again of another much needed investment with them again, but lack any interest in doing so.... just as much as the retailers lack the interest in making the orders too.......
Really to much to chew over here......

However my comments still stand, historically they have shown a good level of customer service and help, with some resonable advise and assistance to many over the years, i imagine it must wear thin though, years of the same silly questions, the same endless quotes and the same infuriating people!

So perhaps something to justify their maddness.......

(spelling is apalling of course!:D)

Very well put, it's one of those love hate situations :)

[Stuart Bertram]

Damiano;2462767]Unfortunately mike, they own the companies, the factories, the brands, the products and are free to do as they like, a case of fit in....or f..... off.[/b]

I really get exasperated with people bringing down what could be an excellent forum with comments like this. You hide behind a pseudonym, talking about things you pretend to profess about.

If you do not like D-D then that is fine with us as you obviously do not know what we are really about and how hard we work to help the hobby and hobbyist but if you feel like that then you are free to keep away from our forum.

The attitude has been extended hard in the uk. Many customers have been put off, many outlets holding accounts with D-D have spoken freely that they have experienced sour times from D-D, the times have changed. Clearly they must have bigger fish to fry here..... (excuse the pun!) In truth too many have experienced the rough end of them over the last 18 months...
We are unfortunately unable to write freely about details regarding these issue due to the fact that they are sponsors, they will be supported regardless....

The word sponsor means that we pay money to help towards the running of the forum so that people like yourself can enjoy it. It is not a shield to hide behind and sometimes makes me wonder if it is worth it.

If you have something to say then perhaps you could PM me about it and I will see what I can do to help these upset shops and sour relationships so that something positive is produced rather than you just making empty insinuations and hiding behind your avatar.

D-D cannot continue to justify their ridiculous price hikes to the general masses, even the letters send out to retailers justifying these are nonsense. i do the maths, the raw materals, the fuels, labours, excesses, shipping marketing etc. doesn't make sense, unless of course someone owes the bank manager........?! :whistling:

There was a 5% price hike from the Deltec factory last year for the first time in 2 years and nothing this year at all. However unless you live in a bubble you will know that the UK is not doing so well against Europe and that the pound is worth very little on the continent.

This time 2 years ago the exchange rate against the Euro was 1.49 and 1 year ago it was 1.32 - about 11% drop in value. Now it is 1.12 a further 15% drop.

It does not take a rocket scientist to see that exchange rates like this will result in year on year price increases which are beyond our control. Of course if you live in mainland Europe you will not see these increases as you are both buying and selling in Euros.

You may also be interested to know that we supply shops in Europe with many goods on the basis of how competitive we are. Products like 1lt of Rowaphos for example sell for about 65 euros £59 in Germany through the German distributor.

And no we do not owe the money to the bank.

The only saving grace is the Wolfgang substantially over engineered the products, making them last longer as a result, be hardier, and have a real feeling of weight and quality. Without this D-D would never exist.

Deltec do make excellent products I must agree however as Deltec is only about 15% of our turnover as a company I think your comment is a little missinformed.

Many of us feel Deltec would have been in a very different market if Terry, or others had been able to secure what David did with the company. It is with great regret though that i doubt anything has affected their sales globaly. but i know now (still counting too!) of around £27,000 in lost sales that have directly arisen from recent times with D-D, around £3400 was from me alone.

It takes real drive and enthusiasm for both the product the hobby to do what David does. Most people with the green eyed envy may wish that they could do so well in retrospect but do not have the commitment and passion to make it a reality.

If you are talking about lost sales to the web company who was selling imported goods at retailer cost price +£3 and taking business from all of the shops in the UK then this does not interest me at all as it is not a sound business model for any shop. Anyway did this web company not just go into receivership this week??

I do not know what you do to feed yourself on a daily basis however I will guess you do not work for free and as most of the shops out there work very hard for little reward then these are the people that we support on a daily basis.

I'm staring down the barrel again of another much needed investment with them again, but lack any interest in doing so.... just as much as the retailers lack the interest in making the orders too.......
Really to much to chew over here......

I think that the lack of interest from dealers is a result of having to match online businesses who will sell goods for nothing in desperation rather than because of their dealing with D-D.

However my comments still stand, historically they have shown a good level of customer service and help, with some resonable advise and assistance to many over the years, i imagine it must wear thin though, years of the same silly questions, the same endless quotes and the same infuriating people!

So perhaps something to justify their maddness.......

I can not believe that after your rant you end it on such a positive note.

We continue to offer the same level of help and advice to the same questions year on year to a point where sometimes I think I am a personal reply system for the reef hobby worldwide.

We do this because it is important to offer information and back up and is also the reason why we get so upset when we get this sort of bashing.

(spelling is apalling of course!:D)[/quote]

Whose spelling yours or ours???

I do not wish to turn this into a battle and was close to closing the forum this morning however I was reminded by some of my co-workers how many positive replies we get for our help and efforts.

Of course you hardly ever hear the positive comments just the negative threads like this.

Stuart
D-D

[Dami]

You hide behind a pseudonym, talking about things you pretend to profess about.

Hardly hiding am i?!


If you do not like D-D then that is fine with us as you obviously do not know what we are really about and how hard we work to help the hobby and hobbyist but if you feel like that then you are free to keep away from our forum.

I will :laugh:

The word sponsor means that we pay money to help towards the running of the forum so that people like yourself can enjoy it.

Are you suggesting this forum exists because of you? and is only able to exist because of YOUR generosity?

If you have something to say then perhaps you could PM me about it and I will see what I can do to help these upset shops and sour relationships so that something positive is produced rather than you just making empty insinuations and hiding behind your avatar.

No, i have PM'ed persons!, and don't wish to waste time making pointless ventures. I think plenty know who is behind this Avatar. Can come and visit you though if you'd prefer? :) i've nothing to hide.....

You may also be interested to know that we supply shops in Europe with many goods on the basis of how competitive we are. Products like 1lt of Rowaphos for example sell for about 65 euros £59 in Germany through the German distributor.

Fair enough. :applause:

It takes real drive and enthusiasm for both the product the hobby to do what David does. Most people with the green eyed envy may wish that they could do so well in retrospect but do not have the commitment and passion to make it a reality.

I've spoken with David before, and even commented on his clear and unrivaled passion and interest. He has offered a great deal of kindness too, however that is as an individual, i am taking purely about the company.

If you are talking about lost sales to the web company who was selling imported goods at retailer cost price +£3 and taking business from all of the shops in the UK then this does not interest me at all as it is not a sound business model for any shop.

I am unaware of this shop/ecommerse effort, i am talking about Fish SHOPS, people with premise, staff, stocks, etc......

I can not believe that after your rant you end it on such a positive note.

:rolleyes:

We continue to offer the same level of help and advice to the same questions year on year to a point where sometimes I think I am a personal reply system for the reef hobby worldwide.

We do this because it is important to offer information and back up and is also the reason why we get so upset when we get this sort of bashing.

Do you feel this is a targeted "bashing" then, or a place where people have written thier experiences with D-D.....
It is with deep regret then i inform you that so long as customers are dissatisfied then you will recieve feed back that is to that effect.

Some (a carefully choosen word!) individuals have been left with a bad taste in their mouths having attempted to make proceedings / resolve issues / fix problems etc, and as long as you hold a place public that people can offer feed back you will unfortunately live out those events for the great majority to read.
It is a public place!, and within the rules of the forum, and the laws of this country, people are free to speak.

Whose spelling yours or ours??? Mine! :D
Stuart
D-D
.

[Dami]

Actually, just before i leave, why did Deltec systemised aquaria jump up 100% in price last year?.........

[Stuart Bertram]

Last year Deltec investigated the amount of work spent to create a microreef and decided that they were losing money on every one and so they put their price up accordingly.

If you are Jewel making 1000's of identical tanks per week then it is easy to have a small low price however when each one is made individually it is much more expensive.

The Microreef is not good value for money compared with a larger laminate version of say 130 x 60 x 50 which has the same amount of work involved in manufacture at a similar price or not much higher price.

We cannot control the pricing or costs set at the factory nor can we control the depreciation of the Pound against the Euro.

Stuart

[~JayK~]

Issues asside here - as they have nothing to do with me personally, but I have to say that I admire how this thread has been left open for all to see.

In my opinion, it shows a positive stance on keeping everything in the open - which a lot of sponsors could learn from, as we as reefkeeping nerds - do sometimes have issues that need discussing - which is evident here (good or bad), but one sided comments only in the sponsors sections are very biased.
From what has gone on here - the best thing is that people will be able to make their decisions of intended purchases based on both good and bad comments.

Full Respect to you for leaving this open!

Jay

[Kev s]

I agree with Jay.

Great to hear Stuarts response, its a hard market and profit is key for long tem success.

Anyone can sell stuff for no profit, but bespoke and small production volume kit is always going to be expensive if you are spending on R & D, which any manufacturer copying kit won't be doing.

D+D is a niche business, making high quality kit. I wish them all the best in the harder times ahead.

Kev

[poohpouri]

if someone is not happy with service from a company surely they should try and solve it amicably, if no good take your business else where, as times are hard for everyone at the mo and value for money is more important,eg Some of the low price high street stores that keep prices as low as they can and provide good customer service are actually making a profit.
The customer can alway vote by taking his money to spend else where and actually help the smaller lfs survive you may pay a bit more but surely have better customer service? just my 2pence worth. :thanks: